Healing with Kana

Plant Power: Unlocking Consciousness and Healing with Kana with Stephanie Wang the Founder & CEO KA! Empathogenics

oin us on “Plant Power,” where we explore the fascinating world of consciousness and the incredible healing potential of psychoactive plants with Stephanie Wang. In this podcast, we delve into the personal journey of our host, who hails from Hong Kong and shares a powerful transformation from the world of finance to plant-based healing.

Discover the enchanting world of Kana, a psychoactive succulent from South Africa, used for centuries by indigenous tribes for social, spiritual, and even hunting purposes. This remarkable plant works on multiple neuro pathways, offering a unique blend of calming effects and uplifting energy. Our host shares how this experience of profound love and expansion changed her life and led her to create “KA and Pathogenics.”

As we dive deep into the science and spirituality behind Kana, our team of experts guides us through its benefits, safety, and the importance of education. Through engaging discussions and expert insights, we aim to bring this lesser-known plant to the forefront and offer an accessible path to wellness, grounding, and joy.

Join us on “Plant Power” as we uncover the secrets of Kana and explore its potential to elevate consciousness and transform lives. Whether you’re new to the world of psychoactive plants or an experienced enthusiast, this podcast is for you. Discover the heart-centered journey of Kana and unlock the power of plant-based healing for a more connected and harmonious life.


00:01 Eric:

This is the Roots to Risk Podcast hosted by Eric Schneider, alongside Isaac Bach. Roots To Risk brings you insights, the latest stories, and long form discussions about the cannabis industry. You’ll hear interviews with industry leaders and their perspective on current and future trends, how they’ve built success and what challenges they have faced. Our goal is to facilitate candid conversations and provide informative content for the cannabis community at large. Let’s go.

00:28 Eric:

What is going on, Isaac? How are we feeling today?

00:31 Isaac:

Doing good. It’s a frog ice, so can’t com. Can’t complain on frog ice. How are you doing?

00:36 Eric:

I’m great. Excited to, to get this one, uh, to get this one rolling. We have Stephanie Wang with KA and Pathogenics, um, specifically focused around the psychedelic compound kana, which I’m really excited to learn a lot more about. Um, it’s, it’s, you know, based off of like preliminary research, you know, psychoactive that’s safe and non-addictive. It’s a sacred plant that has been used by indigenous, uh, in South Africa specifically for medicinal social and spiritual purposes.

01:09 Eric:

Um, so excited to hear more of what Stephanie’s building at CAS specifically, as well as just the, the overall product itself.

01:19 Isaac:

Yeah, me too. I mean, I know you know Stephanie pretty well and met her at one of the, the Trailblazers events that I wasn’t able to get to, so I’m excited to meet her and, uh, hear more about the plant itself and then the product that they’re making.

01:31 Eric:

Absolutely. Let’s bring her in. Hey Stephanie. How we doing today? Happy.

01:37 Stephanie Wang:

I’m good. I’m good. How are you, Eric, how’s it going?

01:40 Eric:

I’m great. I’m great. It’s been a little while. Where, where are you, uh, where are you dialing in from?

01:44 Stephanie Wang:

Madrid in Spain. <laugh>.

01:46 Isaac:

That’s awesome. That sounds

01:47 Stephanie Wang:

Amazing. Yeah.

01:49 Eric:

Is that,

01:50 Stephanie Wang:

It’s pretty amazing time. I live here now, although I do travel back to the US like three or four times a year.

01:57 Eric:

New York. Yeah, because I remember we first originally met was at Trailblazers in, I believe.

02:03 Stephanie Wang:

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. That, that

02:05 Eric:

Was awesome. Uh,

02:06 Stephanie Wang:

<laugh> super awesome. But

02:08 Eric:

No, really appreciate you joining us today on, on Roots to Risk and excited to, to highlight what you’re doing and, um, building at ca and Pathogenics. And, you know, for the viewers, if you can just give us a little background on yourself as well as the organization and, and what you’re building, that would be great.

02:24 Stephanie Wang:

Sure. Um, so I’m from Hong Kong originally and have always been super passionate about consciousness and also power, the power of plants in helping us actually raise our consciousness. And, uh, yeah, I started my life in finance and got really burnt out and, uh, you know, had a lot of, uh, health issues as a result as well, and, you know, had my own healing journey. And that started many years ago.

02:55 Stephanie Wang:

And, um, you know, it just made me, and then a lot of, uh, just to give you a little bit background, because I think anybody who is in this field in the psychedelic healing slash psychoactive plant medicine Yeah. Industry, have their own personal story. And for me, you know, it was a lot of depression earlier on, you know, um, just from, just from past trauma, et cetera. And that combined with being completely burnt out, you know, in investment banking just put me on a whole other path.

03:27 Stephanie Wang:

So I eventually went into film and, um, from there I still wasn’t, you know, even though I was doing social issues, uh, documentary making, which was very interesting and much more aligned to with who I am, I felt it was still kind of not there yet until I got, uh, introduced to the people at Evolver and, you know, which is the consciousness transformational community. And from there, things changed a lot. So I felt finally aligned.

03:57 Stephanie Wang:

It’s like, this is, these are all the topics I’m interested in. Uh, and I, and then we also, from that point on, birthed the Alchemist Kitchen was a, which is a botanical dispensary as well, and also, you know, a place where you can learn about all kinds of esoteric stuff, including all kinds of things about plants and, you know, other esoteric topics like sacred geometry, stuff like that.

04:19 Stephanie Wang:

And ultimately though, I felt a real calling to do something on my own again. And at that point, I, this is 10 years ago now that I had my very first shamanic plant medicine journey. And it wasn’t with ayahuasca or psilocybin or anything like that. It was actually with Kana. So for most people who don’t know what Kana is, it’s a psychoactive succulent that’s from South Africa, and it’s been used by, taken by the indigenous koi and sand tribe for hundreds and thousands of years, even I wouldn’t even say, like, for a long time.

04:59 Stephanie Wang:

And it’s really centered to their, um, social spiritual culture. So it’s, it’s crucial, uh, and essential to their, um, you know, for, for very many aspects of their lives. It’s not just on the healing side, but on, you know, social celebration side. And traditionally, they actually take Kana to go on hunts because of its ability to lower stress and anxiety and give this boost in sustained energy as well as focus while having this amazing heart opening effect as well, so that they feel completely connected with nature, the rest of the hunting party, uh, and the animal that they’re pursuing.

05:42 Stephanie Wang:

So it’s, it’s this beautiful sort of, um, heart opening and pathogenic plant. And so the reason why, you know, why was it, why was it so profound? The first Kana ceremony that I ever did is because it really connected me to a feeling of profound love and expansion that I had never experienced in my life. And it wasn’t, it’s not psychedelic, so there weren’t any hallucinations, but just imagine that you’re embraced in a way that you cannot possibly have a negative thought.

06:17 Stephanie Wang:

Like you just love everything and everyone, and you start to really appreciate your, you know, everything around you and your part in it, and just having this profound gratitude as well, and just this feeling of oneness, which of course, you know, a lot of entheogenic plants do that as well. But this, the, the way Conor works is a little bit different because it’s actually through the heart.

06:40 Stephanie Wang:

And so, you know, it’s really a feeling of that connection and oneness through the heart and through this feeling of love, which is what makes it so, so amazing. So that really made an impact on my life and helped me a great deal during my healing journey in the last 10 years. And so, you know, I really wanted to bring this to more people because the way I see the world as we are, you know, these days we’re very good in our minds.

07:13 Stephanie Wang:

We’re overly mental, but we’re not often able to ground that into our hearts, into our bodies. And you ask someone, you know, how are you feeling? It’s just like a rote answer. Yeah, I’m fine. But there, nobody’s actually checking in to feel how they feel, nor do they feel comfortable to share, even if they do. So there’s, there’s this disconnection that we have with our own bodies and feelings, and therefore we have this disconnection with each other. We’re just kind of going about our day, and yet at the same time feeling really lonely. So that’s why, that’s why I wanted to create something that I actually could, um, you know, utilize KANA in a, in an accessible way and create formulations, create offerings that could really help people through their day-to-day stress and anxiety, and to really cohere them through that heart centeredness and, and bring more, you know, of an uplift in joy to their life.

08:08 Isaac:

That’s amazing. Um, that’s a really, really cool story. Um, out of curiosity, just because I’m not overly familiar with Kaga, like how long was that ceremony? I know with a lot of the other types of, you know, those ceremonies, it can last for multiple hours. Is that similar with the Kaga one you participated again, okay.

08:26 Stephanie Wang:

Similar mm-hmm. <affirmative>

08:28 Eric:

And, and how did that morph to KA and Pathogenics, right? Which is, you know, your project and, um, would love to just learn a little bit more about the product that you have and what offering and, you know, is that like something that people can take daily or is it like for a specific

08:45 Stephanie:

Instance? Yes, they can, and this is the beauty of it. So about four years ago is when, you know, I really started in earnest to, to do r and d and you know, we have a team of scientists that are, you know, have PhDs in molecular biology and biochemistry. So it’s taking both through the shamanic spiritual side of things and combining it with the science as well to make sure that, you know, whatever that we create is, is sound on, on all levels on an energetic level and also on, you know, a medicinal level as well.

09:18 Stephanie:

So, um, what I discovered, which was really interesting is, is all of those things that I, you know, shared just now were just experiences, right? And how it feels experientially, but diving into the chemistry of Kana, it’s very interesting. And KANA is, is Skelet tor, it’s a legal psychoactive succulent plant, which is also very interesting because it’s actually an entheogen that’s not psychedelic and that’s absolutely legal.

09:47 Stephanie:

So that was at first very interesting, which made for a really good basis for a business. And then the second thing was that, okay, what other, um, properties does Kana have? And what’s fascinating is that it works on multiple neuro pathways. So unlike let’s say cannabis or some of the other, um, entheogen Kna works on, uh, kna is naturally a serotonin reuptake inhibitor and a serotonin releasing agent.

10:19 Stephanie:

So that’s its primary sort of way that the alkaloids work. However, it also stimulates receptors for gaba, for opioids, for cholecystokinin and melatonin, just to name a few. And there’s more actually. And so it has this interesting ability where it calms the mind, right? And it lifts mood, you know? Um, and because it actually stimulates receptors for natural opioids, it also has this ability to relieve pain and make you feel good, right?

10:49 Stephanie Wang:

In a, in a healthy way.

10:51 Stephanie Wang:

And, uh, with melatonin, it also, you know, because it’s stimulating receptors for melatonin, it also helps you improve sleep quality. And then what’s really interesting is that all of those things are like sort of more calming sed, you know, sedative effects, but because it also stim, excuse me, because it also inhibits an enzyme called PDE four, it actually helps the body resource more energy. And that’s why it has this almost contradictory description of being able to calm and uplift at the same time.

11:24 Stephanie Wang:

And the uplift and that energy that it gives you is not sort of a, you know, the energy that let’s say stimulant would give you. So it’s not, you know, sort of jittery or anything like that at all. It’s a very grounded energy, which is also beautiful. Yeah. So, um, so there’s that. And then because, uh, it also stimulates receptors for coys declining, it actually helps suppress appetite.

11:47 Stephanie Wang:

And that’s another reason why the hunter gatherers, the cocoa in the sun would take it, because if they’re going along long hunting journeys, they don’t wanna then stop and take a break for food. So they just keep going. And what’s interesting is it suppresses hedonic cravings and hedonic hunger and not homeostatic hunger. So what that means is hedonic hunger is anything like excessive cravings. Like you wanna eat 10 chocolate bars, right? Versus homeostatic hunger is basically hunger that sig that signals to your, to you that you need to eat to just maintain your bodily functions in a healthy way.

12:22 Stephanie Wang:

So that, that’s the difference. So, you know why this is interesting because it works in so many neuro pathways and neuroreceptors is because it also has an adaptogenic effect because of this. So what it’s doing, what Kana does, and its alkaloids are doing, which are the main two alkaloids are Meine and Meza Bruno, is that it’s actually recalibrating your brain almost back to factory settings.

12:46 Stephanie Wang:

And it’s kind of unplugging you from the matrix at the same time. So you’re not in this super fight or flight mode. And that’s what makes it super interesting. It’s also non-addictive and it has very few contraindications. So the only people who really shouldn’t be taking it at the same time are people who are on SSRIs or MAOIs or SNRIs. But that’s about it. And an added bonus is that it actually pairs really well with cannabis. So I know you guys have a huge cannabis audience as well.

13:21 Stephanie Wang:

Yep. And this is really fascinating because it actually takes away for people who sometimes get, let’s say, paranoid or, you know, feelings like that, it helps completely alleviate that and it also helps prolong the beneficial feelings or the sort of happy feelings of what cannabis gives as well.

13:40 Isaac:

That’s amazing. Uh, it seems like a very all encompassing plant. I think. Um, you know, one of the things that you’ve done a great job thus far for Eric and I who you know, don’t know Conga as well as some other substances we work with is education. So how has that process been, you know, with your consumers and just the market in general? Like, how much of you and your team’s focus is really on the educational piece and explaining the benefits of this plan?

14:04 Stephanie Wang:

Thank you for asking that question, because it’s a huge part. What we’ve discovered is it’s first of all still relatively unknown and even among the psychedelic community, it’s not that known. Um, and so that’s been, uh, uh, both a blessing and a challenge because people are curious to know ’cause they don’t know. And then we, we have to spend quite a bit of time, you know, educating people about that. So we do that through social media. We’re about to launch our blog. There’s gonna be a lot more material there for people to do a deep dive. And, you know, we make ourselves as available as we can and people can always email in and ask questions.

14:41 Stephanie Wang:

But going forward, you know, we’d like to, and doing podcasts like this is really helpful just to share this information out there because, you know, it would be wonderful for people to have another option.

14:51 Stephanie Wang:

And again, of course, there’s never one size fits all for plant medicine. Some people prefer their their cannabis, some people prefer their mushrooms, right? Um, and sometimes you need a little bit of both on different occasions depending, right? So, and where all of us are unique creatures, and that also is a beautiful thing. It’s also important to recognize because then what we’re doing is that okay, giving, here’s another option, which is great, right? It may or may not work with people and it may be an option for some somebody who, let’s say those other plants don’t really work well with or not on a day-to-day basis at least.

15:23 Stephanie Wang:

So I think finding that and fine tuning that by just experiencing yourself is really important. And that’s a learning process, but that’s also your own healing process, right? With each individual as well. And Eric, you know, you asked earlier about, um, safety, right?

15:39 Stephanie Wang:

Can you take it every day? And we actually absolutely recommend that for people who, who want to try that it’s safe to take every day. And, um, because of, you know, of first of all has pretty good safety, clinical safety data, and also we, the way we formulated car, which of which kana is only one ingredient. We have many other ingredients that, you know, comprise of our patent pen, uh, patent pending formulation.

16:12 Stephanie Wang:

And those plants include snow, Lotus, Ella, lavender and Mint and Snow Lotus is this beautiful plant, it’s one of the, excuse me, it’s the highest growing plant in the world, grows above 21,000 feet. So it comes from the Himalayas and is super anti-inflammatory, helps with us, meaning helping us maintain homeostasis. Uh, ELA is originally from the Amazon, but now it grows in many places. And it is a plant that is super antimicrobial among many other amazing benefits.

16:43 Stephanie Wang:

And it’s actually, when you take car into your mouth, you’ll start to feel a tingling. And that tingle actually comes from mcm. ’cause what MCM is doing is it’s stimulating your salivary, salivary glands to prepare for absorption of all the other plant ingredients, you know, that are part of the chew. So all these plans work together synergistically to actually enhance and prolong the benefits of Kana. And, you know, took us a while to actually come up with this combination. Um, yeah, I was

17:12 Eric:

Just about to ask like, you know, how, like, what was the, was it, was it a lot of trial and error? You know, did you understand, uh, the benefits of the plants or, you know, what was that process like?

17:23 Stephanie Wang:

Absolutely. I mean, it was, it was a highly scientific process and also, um, an energetic process because combining plants, you also have to be careful, you know, from a shamonic standpoint, like what works with what I mean, it’s, you know, the, I’ll, I’ll be perfectly honest, a big part of that came from sort of, um, channeling through ancestors and, and all of that. It’s okay, what’s, what some of, what should, what should we actually try with this? And then we came up with this, uh, with this formulation, which we’re very excited about.

17:53 Eric:

That’s great. And, and so what’s on the, you know, are there, are there like others that are, you know, similar to you and, and for like, you know, you know, for us, right? Like as Isaac had mentioned, you know, this is, this is a really great conversation because we, we love this. ’cause, you know, sometimes cannabis is, is a beautiful plant and it’s great, you know, but a lot of the conversations are, you know, relatively similar. Like, this is just unique and different and, and exciting. And so like, are there others, like in your circle that are also, you know, producing KANA related products?

18:27 Eric:

Like, you know, what is, what does that market look like?

18:32 Stephanie Wang:

Uh, yes, absolutely. There are many people who are doing that. I mean, right now, uh, what I’ve seen out there is there are, let’s say people who are already selling herbal tinctures and that sort of thing. And they have a, I would say a collection of many different plants. And one of them is kana that’s been sort of out there. But what we’ve seen recently is that there are more companies coming out that are specializing in okay. That that’s their thing. You know, KANA is their, you know, hero ingredient and their company and messaging is built around that.

19:03 Stephanie:

So absolutely there are other, there are absolutely others out there. And it’s exciting because again, you know, the more people, um, the more options out there for people, the more people can learn, more opportunities that people can learn about this amazing plant, the better.

19:18 Eric:

What, what is, because obviously you’re, you’re calling from Madrid, I know we, we met in the us Are there like any areas of the world that have like adopted this much more so than, you know, maybe the US or, or other parts? Just curious like, ’cause I know it’s obviously a legal plant so it can be shipped all over the world. Like have you seen certain markets, you know, adopt this more quickly or just anything?

19:44 Stephanie:

Yes. The, the only places South Africa where it’s from, so interestingly, um, doctors there actually use it to treat addiction like alcoholism. Got it. Because, um, of the way that KANA can actually reset those neuro pathways, like I just mentioned, it’s actually used for treating addiction. And it’s interesting because you have, you know, alcohol, you know, you have alcohol in addiction, but I mentioned hedonic cravings, so, you know, addiction to sugar, addiction to other substances. It’s, it’s really interesting.

20:15 Stephanie:

And I think, you know, I hope that there’s gonna be a lot more research done on that, and I believe that someone is doing that already. Uh, but in, in, in South Africa it’s been, you know, used that way to treat, treat addiction and to treat depression, which is the more common thing, right? And, uh, so yeah, it’s, it’s out there. And, uh, what again is so interesting is that it doesn’t have the side effects of, let’s say taking a, an SSS R i an S S R I or something, uh, you know, a pharmaceutical SS SS R or something like that.

20:47 Stephanie:

And, um, you know, hey, we’re, we’re a C P G brand. We’re not, we cannot make any claims. We’re just a supplement company, of course. Um, but there’s just, it’s an interesting, it’s an interesting, um, topic to, to explore further

21:02 Isaac:

Now. Absolutely. And building off of that, just based off of Eric’s question, I mean, what has the reception been, you know, in the US and western Europe? Um, you know, both from a consumer perspective, but also from, you know, the legal and kind of financial aspect. Like, are you running into some of the same issues that, um, some of our other client base are from, like raising money or how has that looked for you all? Um, as it relates to the, the adoption?

21:28 Stephanie:

So to answer your question, the first part is, you know, is Kana even anywhere else? It’s really not, you know, if it is, it’s like minuscule. It’s, it’s insignificant. So the US is, and South Africa of course, but then the US is, is, or you know, uh, I’m sure actually, I don’t know, I have to check, but maybe in Canada that’s already, there’s somebody actually also actually doing this. I have not seen it in Europe. Uh, I may be wrong that, you know, maybe there is, uh, maybe it is there, but I have not seen it and most people have no idea.

22:02 Stephanie:

And, uh, in terms of raising funds, that was your question, right, Isaac?

22:07 Isaac:

Yep. Correct. Yep.

22:09 Stephanie:

<laugh>, um, in terms of raising funds, it’s, yes, you know, we’ve been encountering the same challenges. It’s been, you know, market is not great at the moment. And yeah, you know, it’s, it’s been, it’s been challenging. What I will say though is that on the consumer side, on the customer side, it’s been really, really gratifying to just see the testimonials to, to hear from people how it’s actually helped them. And so, um, that’s been really

22:39 Eric:

Interesting. Do you have, do you have like one, like one testimonial that like, sticks out, you know, that from, from someone who’s, you know, taken the product and, and had a, you know, a, a great experience, like one that just maybe resonates with you?

22:53 Stephanie:

Yes. I, I have two, I believe the first one is someone who’s taken car, who, you know, is, had been going through menopause and she was experiencing a ton of anxiety as a result. And she could not see, she had insomnia all the time, and she was taking half a Xanax every night just to be able to get, you know, get to bed. And she, when she tried car, that completely eliminated her need to take Xanax.

23:24 Stephanie:

It was so helpful for her. She slept a lot better. It was incredible. And, and really alleviated, alleviated her anxiety. So it was really life-changing. So that was, that was one. And the second one is actually one that I, uh, received recently. It was from one of the customers who was a sub, uh, who was a subscriber. Uh, so she, you know, orders monthly and takes it consistently.

23:48 Stephanie:

And she, she wrote this beautiful review and she was saying how it helped her, and she also has her daughter take it as well. And that it’s helped both of them tremendously. Uh, for, for the daughter in, in school, you know, it’s just, it’s helped her focus, it’s helped keep her very even keeled, calm in a great mood. And for mom as well, it’s been, it’s been similar. So, you know, it, it’s interesting because we do encourage people to take it more than just the ones to, to, let’s say tactically address the stress of that day, which you can of course do.

24:26 Stephanie:

But what I’ve noticed myself, and I didn’t even start to do this until about maybe a few months ago, I started taking it every day. And as a startup founder, obviously I’m super stressed ’cause there’s so much going on. I have to raise money, I have to do this and that.

24:41 Stephanie:

And it was, it was awesome because it actually, because I took it, you know, uh, you should take it on an empty stomach, just first experience what the full benefit is like. And I have to get you both a pack because you have to try it. <laugh>, absolutely. I should send it to ahead of time. So, um, but you know, I would take it in the morning before breakfast, before I start my day and it sets the tone. It’s like a stress preventer, which is great. So that, you know, some crazy stuff happens during the day and I don’t get knocked off my horse, you know, I just go, okay, this sucks, but I can deal with it.

25:18 Stephanie:

And this is the beauty also, because when we’re not in fight or flight mode and we’re better able to, to resource mentally, it actually helps us problem solve.

25:27 Stephanie:

And that’s another thing I found about ka kana as well, helps to, helps to, to do this, is that because you’re not in this sort of super hyper-focused, you know, panic emergency mode, and your body is not in that situation, you’re able to really perceive much more widely, you, you, you’re able to see sort of solutions lying everywhere. You are able to think more creatively. We had a few artists actually try car and also got some beautiful testimonials from that because it actually really helped them create.

26:00 Stephanie:

’cause they’re like, oh my God, I can think more clearly and I can, like, my brain is just being, you know, able to flow in ways that are less obstructed. And, you know, they could also see they’re like, oh, the colors are brighter even because it, that, that is also an effect that many people report is that their visual acuity improves. So they see colors more brightly, they see outlines more sharply. So that’s also something that’s, that’s, um, that’s pretty amazing.

26:27 Isaac:

No, that’s awesome. I mean, you, you kind of answered the question, but would you recommend when people take it, you know, you take it at the start of the day or you know, obviously it’s an everyday type supplement, but is there a time that you would recommend people, you know, use the supplement?

26:42 Stephanie:

Yes. Um, you can take it at the beginning of the day, like I mentioned, because it just, it’s lovely. It just sets the tone and once you actually last a very long time. So the initial sort of that, that sort of whom something is happening, feeling, you can feel it very obviously in the first hour or so, and then it starts to taper off and, but be, and another thing is great is that you don’t have a crashing feeling afterwards because it’s, it’s adaptogenic in nature and it works in so many neuroreceptors. It doesn’t, you know, it doesn’t fade away like the way c a caffeine crash would have be or some other substances, right?

27:18 Stephanie:

And then as it tapers along, you may not be so aware consciously that, oh my God, I’m feeling something very different. But it’s still there. And I think part of it is the invitation to actually observe what’s going on, you know, with you as well.

27:34 Stephanie:

Like, I noticed I’m a lot more patient and I’m not as short-tempered with people, even if things really frustrate me. And even in the, you know, as I go into the evening, I, I’m still like, oh my God, this is this, I still feel really good. Now everybody’s different. Of course, some people need less, some people might need to choose at a time. But this is another thing we encourage people to do. And in terms of when to car, we say when, when to car <laugh>, you can do it in the morning <laugh>, you can do it in the mid-afternoon when you’re feeling like, oh my God, I’m fading, I’m fading and it’s not dinner time yet.

28:10 Stephanie:

And I’m just like, ugh. And that’s a great time because it does give you boost of energy. Another great time to, to take it is, you know, for people who have a little social anxiety and they’re going out, but they don’t wanna have that, you know, cocktail.

28:24 Stephanie:

And instead of that take a car. And in fact, in Afrikaans in South Africa, Kana is actually called one dry drink. That’s amazing. So yeah. And so that’s another way where you’re like, look, I wanna have that vibe. I wanna feel like the way my friends are because they’re, they’re having some alcohol, but I don’t wanna have alcohol, but I still wanna get, you know, have a change of state. This is another one. You know, great way to do that. Um, one other place is, is I wonder what the way to use it is if you meditate, it’s great to take, uh, 15 minutes before your meditation because it really helps you drop in and your mind isn’t wandering everywhere.

29:05 Stephanie:

It actually really helps you ground and just stay centered. And when you’re centered in body the way you would be sitting in meditation, it actually, for me at least, it helps me channel I actually get some amazing insights and, um, perceptions from it.

29:25 Stephanie:

So that’s something that’s, uh, that’s also a great way to, to take car. And, uh, anytime you do body work, like if you’re doing yoga or even if you’re going for just a massage because of the ability of car to help you relax, you’re actually able to take in that massage or that body work even more. And it kind of doubles, doubles in the effect of the sensorial effects of massaging and having you feel relaxed. Plus your nervous system is relaxed already, and you know, that session, the effect of that session will actually deepen.

29:57 Stephanie:

So that’s another way to, to take it.

30:01 Eric:

A lot of the, a lot of the, I mean, I, I don’t do it as often as I probably should, but, um, I do like transcendental meditation and, um, a lot of the effects like what you’re saying, like after, after a session, you feel like relaxed, but also like heightenedly aware it seems like, uh mm-hmm. <affirmative> very similar state. So I can, I can definitely relate to that. Um, very cool. But

30:25 Stephanie:

Oh yeah.

30:26 Eric:

And then I guess for the next 12 months, like what’s on the docket, you know, what, what are maybe some initiatives that you have with the organization that you’re excited about and, and want to share?

30:36 Stephanie:

Yeah, so actually before I answer that question, Eric, I do wanna, I missed one, one, uh, sure. Way to car that was, is really awesome is to car before you work out. So to take a kaji before you work out, remember that the indigenous would take Kana when they go on multi-day hunts. So it has this amazing, uh, way to support your workout and whatever exercise you’re doing, it actually improves your endurance. And that’s something that, you know, people often forget. You’re like, oh, it’s helping you relax. It’s like, no, it’s actually doing both. It’s helping you relax so you’re not so like, stressed out while you’re working out.

31:09 Stephanie:

Because that could be almost like, oh God, I have to, I have to do this many lifts and I have to, it takes that away and it also actually helps you, uh, sustain that routine and work out and help and keep you help Yeah, help you go further. So we have, I take

31:23 Eric:

It before the Fort Isaac,

31:25 Isaac:

You should take it before the fort. Yeah, you could use it for those thaws <laugh>,

31:29 Eric:

Me, me and Isaac work out at the, the same gym. Um, and

31:33 Stephanie:

Try it, try it too for that. Absolutely. I’ll send some to you. And so, yeah, and, and to answer your question about, um, about the, um, the 12 month plan, we’re super excited that we’re gonna be launching our next product, which is a tincture, uh, in May, fingers crossed. So that’s gonna be sort of the next, the next product, which we’re very excited about. And we can’t wait to get that to, to all of you. And you know, we’re in the middle of fundraising and you know, we’re fundraising for really being able to put more effort behind marketing and, you know, getting the word out.

32:15 Stephanie:

And also we have a lot of other product lines that we want to launch as well. And so, you know, putting in, in, you know, having funds to do the r and d and to get all of that going, uh, for product launches, that that is also also, you know, important. What’s coming up? Well, we’re gonna be at the Psychedelic Science Maps Denver event in June, and we’re gonna be, we’re gonna be there. Okay. And we’re gonna have a booth. So anybody who’s listening, if you’re going to that event, come visit us.

32:49 Stephanie:

You can sample the product and we’ll see. Chat with us. Yeah,

32:53 Eric:

We’re gonna be heading there as well.

32:55 Stephanie:

Oh, cool. Awesome. Yeah.

32:57 Eric:

Yeah. Isaac, well, Isaac, I’ll probably be, you’re gonna be in Denver? Probably. Yeah,

33:02 Isaac:

I won’t, I won’t be out there full time yet. I’m from Colorado originally, so my fiance and I are planning on moving back there over the summer. So I, I might be there looking at neighborhoods around that time anyways.

33:13 Stephanie:

Nice. We’ll,

33:14 Eric:

Uh, we’ll definitely be there and, and for sure stop by. Um, no, that should be definitely a great event. We’re, we’re really excited for that.

33:22 Stephanie:

Yeah. And, um, what else? We are, uh, we just actually filed our patent filed, you know, so that’s why it’s patent pending and this actually just happened a few days ago, so that’s super exciting. Congratulations. That’s awesome. Thank you. Yeah, that’s awesome. And, um, that’s, that feels actually really good. We’re, we’re very happy about that. And you know, in terms of initiatives, what we’ve been, you know, a big part of our brand values is, you know, re you know, is um, is re is regenerative culture.

33:53 Stephanie:

And we, you know, talk a lot about indigenous wisdom and how that’s personally of course been, uh, a big inspiration for me in my own healing journey. It’s something I’m deeply interested in, uh, ever since I started doing plant medicine work. And, you know, I feel that in our industries that’s often overlooked, I feel that we need to give a lot of credit to, to, to indigenous cultures who have stewarded a lot of these sacred plants over the many years, despite being persecuted, despite being, you know, maligned.

34:31 Stephanie:

And it’s important, I feel, for us to really remember to give back to those communities. So for example, you know, the way that we source arcana, we’re only sourcing from someone who does a direct profit share with the indigenous and the sun for us on the front end. We’ve been in talks with various organizations in South Africa, indigenous organizations to do the same. It’s just been actually very challenging because, um, politically and the way organizations are out there, it’s, it’s a little bit hard to, to vet and, you know, it’s just taking us a lot longer than we’d like.

35:12 Stephanie:

But that’s something that we are continually doing and we want to, we want to do. And if even if we, you know, if we cannot do it through, that means I’m gonna find another way to do it somehow. If it means at some point setting up our own sort of foundation or a 5 0 1 C three, you know, we’d love to, we’d love to do that or really partner up with anyone, um, who’s doing the same.

35:34 Stephanie:

And there, I know that there are a lot of people who feel the same way. And, um, that’s important. I think one more thing I will say that’s really exciting looking at the industry overall is, um, what’s, what’s what’s interesting is the car car pathogenic sits kind of in the border between, ’cause we’re like psychedelic adjacent, but we’re not quite psychedelic. So, but we’re very related to psych psychedelic culture, right? We’re part of that. Um, but we’re a C P G company as well.

36:05 Stephanie:

So looking at consumer products, looking at wellness and what’s going on there vis-a-vis, you know, how influenced that has been by the psychedelic culture and by just everything that’s been happening in the world, you know, through the pandemic and such, what has come to, to, um, the forefront is this real need for people. And this has been reported in the Global Wellness Trends report by Global Wellness Summit, that people are really recognizing that the, the root of this sort of cascading mental and emotional issues that people are having really boils down to disconnection and separation, and that they’re really wanting a feeling of connectedness with other human beings and feeling that oneness and that empathy and, um, the love connection really with each other that was really lacking during the pandemic.

37:08 Stephanie Wang:

And it’s, it’s affected a lot of people, right? Um, I’m sure for all of us as well. So, you know, they’re actually looking for something out there, a supplement tools, whatever it is that can actually help them and support them in that way. So again, Kana and KA are very well situated in that sense, because that’s exactly what we’re all about. Our mission is to restore full spectrum of aliveness for all human beings. And we constantly talk about the importance of being heart connected and being able to relate to each other.

37:43 Stephanie Wang:

But first of all, being able to relate to yourself and feel your own feelings. You know, our motto is feel yourself. And part of that is then also being able to connect with another person, right? And I think Kana as a, from a, from a shamanic, cosmo, cosmological standpoint is heart medicine. It’s not spirit medicine the way Ayahuasca is, for example. It is heart medicine and it is actually energetically geared towards doing that.

38:15 Stephanie Wang:

And that we have absolutely found, you know, is the way I’ve, I’ve explained how kind of works and the effects and experiences people have when they take Hana. And, um, you know, I truly believe that this is a plant teacher in a different way. This is kind of as a plant teacher that teaches us connection again.

38:36 Eric:

Very cool. No, that’s, that’s, it’s, uh, really powerful and I think, you know, very, very on point with, uh, with needed and, and needed, um, in, in today and a lot of the, the mental health crisis. And, um, it’s just very interesting. I think it’s, you know, for, for me today personally, I learned a ton. Um, and, uh, and no, before we wrap things up here and, and really appreciate your time, Stephanie, we’re gonna give it to, uh, to Isaac. Just, uh, a few, few fun questions before you wrap things up.

39:08 Eric:

Yeah. Just

39:08 Isaac:

A quick couple of, uh,

39:09 Eric:


39:10 Isaac:

Your time re recommendations. So, uh, you know, thank you Eric. We’re building out a playlist, a, uh, a book list and a restaurant list. So what’s, uh, what’s on the top of your playlist these days? Uh, you know, what’s getting you going in the morning or what are you listening to while you take

39:26 Stephanie:


39:28 Isaac:

Oh, I love that.

39:29 Stephanie:

There’s actually a car playlist. Can I share that with you? They’re literally, we actually have a car playlist on Spotify, so I don’t, do you guys have show notes? Is that something we can share or is that something you, you share some other way?

39:43 Eric:

Well, no. So when we, yeah, when we post this, like, we’ll, we’ll send it a long email and so we can put a link to that. Absolutely.

39:51 Stephanie:

Awesome. So, so there’s a whole bunch of songs there. And, uh, the second question was, what’s my favorite book at this moment? Whoa. I, I am very delinquent these days ’cause I’ve been so busy. Um, but I am starting to read this book, which is really interesting, and I, yeah, can I pause? Can you pause so I can grab it so I can Yeah, yeah. Remember what it’s like. So it’s this book, some 40 Tales from the After Lives by David Eagleman.

40:29 Eric:


40:30 Stephanie:

Yeah. And restaurants. Oh my god. Madrid has every restaurant is amazing. Same,

40:35 Isaac:

Honestly, definitely pops on the

40:37 Eric:

Fucking list. Yeah.

40:38 Stephanie Wang:


40:39 Eric:

On my fucking list. Madrid.

40:41 Stephanie:

Stephanie Wang many good restaurants. You have to come, come visit. I’m like,

40:44 Eric:

If I do a vacation, I’m gonna, I’m definitely gonna reach out.

40:47 Stephanie Wang:

You gotta let me know. You gotta let me know when we have to hang out, when get both

40:51 Isaac:

Of you pick Kyle together. <laugh>,

40:53 Stephanie:

<laugh>. Yes, absolutely. So best restaurant. Oh my God. Um, there is one here in Madrid, which is probably my favorite. It’s called ua and it’s famous for its meats and its steaks, but it also serves other foods. That’s awesome. It’s, it’s spectacular. It’s amazing.

41:17 Eric:

That sounds awesome. Well, really appreciate your time today, Stephanie. And, and this has been, you know, super insightful and, and we all learned a lot today. And, uh, excited to get this out and, and publish it and, uh, allow viewers to, to listen in and learn more about kana and what you’re building at KA is, uh, is super exciting. And, and we’ll see you definitely in Denver.

41:39 Stephanie:

Yeah. And, uh, before we end, thank you first of all for having me on the show. Excited to reconnect with you, Eric, and, uh, good to see you, Isaac. The, I would love to offer your audience and you guys, there’s a, um, a discount code you can, they can use, you guys can use for ordering car online and it’s K a r t o R, so it’s car and then route to risk, but instead of route risk, it’s just r t o r.

42:10 Stephanie:

And yeah, you can get a That’s awesome.

42:12 Isaac:

Looking forward to trying it with that. Yeah, thanks Anthony.

42:15 Eric:

Amazing. Well thank you for that. That’s great. Looking forward to

42:17 Stephanie:

Trying it. Yeah. And come follow us on, on Instagram, on, you know, car and Pathogenics,

42:25 Eric:

Another one in the books. And, uh, and very interesting, you know, I know a lot of the stuff that we’ve focused on, Isaac is, you know, related to the cannabis industry and done some stuff in the psychedelic space and, you know, we, we’ve spoken about that we want to have, uh, many more folks in that industry on here on roots to risk because it’s, uh, it’s something that is continuing to evolve and, and grow, and there’s just so many different avenues.

42:55 Eric:

Um, you know, specifically kana, right? Like, I didn’t really know much, you know, going into today, and obviously Stephanie’s explanation and insights was tremendous. Um, but yeah. Any, any additional thoughts?

43:09 Isaac:

No, I mean, I think, uh, I think it’s really cool and I think the product that, that they created and, you know, the new SKUs that they’re coming out with are extremely interesting. One, just because they’re legal, um, doesn’t seem like they have to necessarily jump through some of the hoops that, you know, a lot of our other clients have to deal with, with being schedule one drugs. So, um, I’m for sure excited to try call, you know, sooner other than later. So, yeah, I think you both, you and I both could benefit from, uh, some of the, the benefits that provides

43:38 Eric:

About 10 to 15, just like 10 to 15 things. That sounded pretty good. Yeah. So we’re gonna, we’re gonna give it a go. And, um, no really appreciate Stephanie’s time and very knowledgeable and, and it’s, and like at the end of the day, I feel like we’re like starting to see a theme. It really is just like about education and like getting this information out there, allowing people to learn more about the various products that can help them. As she mentioned, like there’s no one size fit, all right? And, um, you know, everybody has their own individual journey, their own individual, um, preferences.

44:14 Eric:

So very cool to, uh, to have Stephanie on here today talking about kana and, uh, excited for the next one.

44:20 Isaac:

Yeah, me too. Yeah, I love, I love the ones where you and I get very much, uh, an education on from the subject matter experts. So, uh, that was very enjoyable and looking forward to the next one as well.



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